Episode S4E4: Brain Health and Living Well

A few weeks ago we met Jerry Wiles, a choice servant of God who is making a significant contribution for the cause of Christ in encouraging Christians to age well for the sake of the Gospel. 

In today’s podcast Jerry will address the important of brain health and how it applies to us in living well and finishing well. 

Listen well to his story today and take notes on his wisdom about finishing well. Very inciteful.

Learn more about him at Jerry Wiles at Jerry Wiles — James Houston Center or Jerry Wiles - Speakers Bureau | Leadershipbooks.com

Transcript

Dr Hal Habecker: 0:00

Music. Welcome to the finish and well podcast where we encourage seasoned believers to find meaningful ways to impact their world for the kingdom of God, whether you're 65 and up or not quite there. Yet, our mission is to prepare and encourage every person to finish well. Our prayer is that this podcast will encourage and strengthen you to glorify Christ as we intentionally engage our aging fears. Welcome to the finishing well podcast today, folks. I'm Hal habecker with finishing well ministries. And we, as a ministry and as a our purpose is focused on helping us, as we age, to be all that God calls us to be, and part of that is to be healthy. And there's a whole enterprise out there, a whole area of learning called brain health, which, as we grow, we want to sharpen our mental capabilities for doing things that God wants us to do, and it all revolves around the idea of brain health. So our guest today is Jerry Wiles from Houston. We had him on a few weeks ago, and he's really gifted, and God is, in a sense, brought him into this arena with expertise. And welcome Jerry. I'm looking forward to our discussion on brain health today.

Jerry Wiles: 1:28

Well, I am, too. This is an important topic

Dr Hal Habecker: 1:32

as we begin. Why don't we begin with just some basics? Let's I'm new to this. I haven't done a lot of reading on brain health, but give us the basics. What is it? Why is it important? How does the brain work, and what are we talking about physiologically when we think of brain health?

Jerry Wiles: 1:51

Well, one of the things, one of the important things, is to realize that our brain is constantly changing. And the term used, neuro plasticity is something that that's not a common name that's used, but it has to do with the brain, the way we learn, the way we think, learning new things, and the way the brain can continue to change and improve over time. So a good way to think about this is clarity, connectedness and emotional balance. So the professionals in this area, and I've gotten quite acquainted with a number of neuroscientists, neuro neurologists and other people dealing with these issues, but a brain if our brain is not focusing properly, if we have now, of course, now there's a concern about degenerative brain diseases and dementia. Alzheimer's is the most common, but so now the whole brain health, the memory care industry is is huge, and memory loss and then, and then thinking about memory enhancement, what can we do to build a better brain, to improve our brain functions? And there's certain lifestyle changes that we can incorporate into our lives. It's going to make our brain healthier. Okay,

Dr Hal Habecker: 3:18

now, you mentioned those three things, clarity. The third one was emotional balance. What are those three things? Again, we're talking about connectedness. Connectedness. What does that mean? What talk about connectedness for a second? Well,

Unknown: 3:32

you know, I think we were, we were created for relationship. We were created to be, I mean, we're members of the Body of Christ. When we think about getting into the biblical aspect of it. So we are members, in particular, of the body corporate, so the body of Christ, and that's in my thinking, the Connecting is we're talking about now, there are other social, psychological, emotional connections that we can have, but that's the most important connection. I was fascinated

Dr Hal Habecker: 4:01

we talk about brain health as a modern day phenomena. You start looking at the scriptures and you see the value of friendships and relationships that are there. They've been there ever since God created us to be in relationship with Himself and each other, and it's almost as if we've gotten away from some of the fundamental issues, and if we got back to them, they would really help us.

Unknown: 4:26

Yes, and brain health and memory are tied together, and remember is the second most given command throughout all of Scripture, and we can only live out what remember. Doesn't matter how many degrees we have or how many books we've read, we can only live out what we remember. So there is a biblical foundation for that, and then looking at all the other places where we can learn about cognitive functions, cognitive cognitive Advantage programs. And so I'm connected with a good number of organizations that are dealing. These, these issues all the time. Well, keep

Dr Hal Habecker: 5:02

those in mind when we get to the end of our podcast. I'd love for you to give some of those, and we could actually print those out when this podcast goes out, maybe two or three or four, some of those fundamental things resources you could give us. So how do we do this? I mean, you've put out some fundamentals, the importance of how we think, how our brain works. What are next steps we begin to take as we focus in on this? Well, a

Unknown: 5:34

healthy brain is going to affect every aspect of our lives. So there's brain health, mental fitness and that are related and memory. These are all related issues now. So I'm focused on things that, what can we do to make our brain healthier, and how can we improve our mental capacity, mental fitness and our memory? So some very practical things that I found in my experience and my research, some simple things that we can do, like Bible reading now. So reading the Bible out loud is more beneficial than reading it silently, because you're saying it, you're hearing it and you're seeing it. Bible storying, but it's another aspect. So telling stories and telling stories is the best way to activate the brain and telling stories and then social interaction. So, and the last time we talked about socialization, exercise, nutrition, sleep, and, of course, spiritual life and and education. So education being just continuing to learn, learn new things, do, do new things and do things differently. I mean, some, there's 1001 things that we can do, little things that we can do that the research shows are beneficial. Just brushing your teeth with your non dominant hand. If you brush your if you're right handed, brush your teeth with your left hand, writing your name with the your non dominant pen. So these are little simple things, little tricks that people have found to be helpful when you go shopping, if you have the time to do so, circle the perimeter of the store and just observe the products on the shelves. That's just a simple thing that neuro neuroscientists say helps so and you can combine physical exercise with mental stimulation, walking, going new places. Take a different route to work or to school or wherever you go, take a different route, do same things, new and that it just expands your awareness and creates neurons, these the way your brain works. I don't get into much of the you know the technical names for it, but basically it's, it's expanding your your brains capacity

Dr Hal Habecker: 8:02

so your your brain works, you know, in a specific way. And let's say you get in ruts in life. You do things the same way all the time. We're creatures of habit. What you're suggesting is that these pathways in the brain, I mean they, in a sense, become, I'll use my term just ruts. And what, what happens when you do things differently, you're forcing your brain or helping your brain to think in different pathways, and it really changes the format of your brain and refreshes your perspective, or something to that end,

Unknown: 8:39

yes. And when we think about the brain and think about memory, there are memory competitions. Every memory competitor uses some form of the method of loci, l, O, C, I. Some people announce it Loki, but it's the Latin root word for location. So they use that form and the memory palace. So our minds think in terms of pictures, action and association. So for example, when we do our morality training, our Bible storying, you use a different part of your brain when you learn that way, than seeing words on paper. You're seeing pictures. You see a picture when you tell the story of Jesus coming the storm, you have a mental picture there. So that's the way the brain works. And we do retain better information when we learn orally than if we're just seeing words on paper and then engage, engaging it, talking about it, having conversations about it, also reinforces that. It

Dr Hal Habecker: 9:38

reminds me you can comment on this years ago, when I was in seminary, I took a memory course with the basketball player Jerry Lucas. He was going around, and there were 300 of us sitting in an auditorium, and he had each one of us stand up and say our names, then sit down. He went the whole way. Around of 250 300 people. And you know, when he finished that, he went through and he could tell everybody's name, and then he handed out this picture New Testament. He had the entire New Testament and pictures, and he could quote the entire New Testament only using picture connections. Amazing. Yeah.

Unknown: 10:20

Well, you know, it takes some discipline to get to that point. And I've known some people who have that motivation and have done things like that. I'm not memorized the Bible yet. I do know, years ago I met a guy who said he had memorized the Bible. Another one had memorized the New Testament. So but I'm a promoter of, proponent of, of learning the most important stories the Bible. So you've got a, you know, a framework for it, but it's that's big task to memorize the Bible.

Dr Hal Habecker: 10:52

It is. It was fascinating for me to sit there and watch him do that. And it's helped me in some ways. But I don't think enough in that way it's really fascinating. Yeah, yeah.

Unknown: 11:02

Well, I with our training, we focus on learn a little, practice a lot, implement immediately, and tell the stories often. So storytelling is the most basic form of this orality movement that I've been on for many years, and that has a lot to do with learning, communication and behavior change, and various disciplines, really, they related to that. So my main focus over the years has been really about, how does this reflect impact the Great Commission? How does it affect our, our, our life in Christ, and how can it be a part of disciple making and reproducing, disciple making church planting movement. So that's the arena I'm thinking about and involved in, and how do these lessons in this area impact those aspects? Well,

Dr Hal Habecker: 11:52

you mentioned that I'd like to come back to that topic in a future podcast and focus on that. But in a sense, I mean, as I listen to you, what you're saying is that brain health is very, very important in discipleship. So what is absolutely, yeah, tell me about that.

Unknown: 12:11

Well, you know, it's just thinking about how we learn, how we communicate and how we pass on information. So when we think about the Great Commission. We think about the Great Commission is going all the world preach the gospel to every person, make disciples of all people groups. Well, most of the world would be considered oral learners by necessity or by preference. People who can't, don't or won't read or prefer to learn by means other than written instruction or print based media. So when we think about how most of the people learn of learning stories, telling stories, asking questions and learning in community, so you have what we learn from the more relational, communal oral cultures, mostly in the Global South, and what are those lessons that would apply here? So when we get into things like cultural value systems, learning and communication preferences and behavior change, how's the best way to bring about behavior change? So these are important aspects. Now, what I really like to focus on is, what do we learn from the life and the spirit and the teachings of Jesus? How did he communicate? How did he make disciples? And we make disciples the way he made disciples. So there's, there's some learning to be, you know, from that, from that area.

Dr Hal Habecker: 13:39

But that's fascinating if, if you don't learn new things about discipleship and the way people live and the way they learn, if your brain health is limited to the way you've always done those things, then there are limitations on all that the Spirit of God may want to do through your life.

Unknown: 13:58

Yeah, I think if we continue to do what we've always done. We're not going to grow and change, but so there's always hope for change. I mean, there's always, I always hope for for change and improving our brain and our mental capacity. And of course, in my journey and recent years with my wife, Sheila, who was diagnosed with Alzheimer's disease, and in 2019 and of course, as that progressed, I was her primary caregiver. I learned a lot at you know, during that season about dealing with dementia, memory loss and that, but, but then just taking normal people, how can they improve their their mental ability and brain health, and minimize the risk of memory loss and and brain disease. So there's lots to be learned about that, and the earlier we start doing these things that we. Know, will improve our brain neuroplasticity, if we can continue to learn new things and look for little things that we do that's going to improve our physical and our spiritual and our emotional and psychological well being.

Dr Hal Habecker: 15:21

I love this idea. Let me take it a different way. Jerry, you know, on our seven essentials, the first thing we talk about is the importance of growing. Well, that implies, or it realizes, that all of life is changing all the time. I mean our I mean every day. We're different people. I mean, you look that over a year and you say, Well, I've really gone through a lot of new things, and how we process those as Christians, I mean, really, and how we and the other angle I want to bring in here, and relates to Sheila, is, what do you do through hardships? So in hardships or a disease or a challenge or whatever you have to learn new things. And it's almost as if God has said in all the transitions and changes of life, whether they're good or hard or negative or what, I'm going to give you an opportunity to grow and think new ways about who you are in relationship to me through this challenge. I mean, so we're always growing. In that sense, our brain is always developing. I mean, it's almost as if God has built has a built in system to help us become who he wants us to be.

Unknown: 16:35

Yeah, in the whole area of therapy, for example, there's a reminiscence therapy or life review therapy, that's a healthy brain exercise, arts and music, art therapy. And there's different drama therapy, there's narrative therapy. I mean, these are different disciplines that can be beneficial to our brain health. And so there's so many different aspects to this, but and then there's a big need for public awareness. And I think we'll get into talking about what churches can do, but I've promoted the idea of churches having a memory support group. You know, we have cancer support groups. We have all kinds of support groups, but very few churches have a memory care support group or memory support group. We've experimented with that a little bit. And I think churches, if, for example, pastors, could have a series of sermons on memory, because the Bible has so much to say about memory, and just give people practical ways of improving the memory.

Dr Hal Habecker: 17:42

So, I mean, let me pick on your experience here with your your wife. Has she transitioned, or is life changed for the two of you? What? What are some things that God did in your life in terms of working on communication and being aware of her changes and your your need to change, etc, etc.

Unknown: 18:01

Well, first of all, I think one of the most difficult things about that journey, and I've read books on this and heard stories from other people, is that the caregivers response and navigating this and not having an understanding of how to relate to people who have Alzheimer's disease. So it's it's a progressive thing, and one of the things I just had to realize, and just know that the grace of God is adequate in any situation, but because of behavior change and personality changes, that's more difficult than the memory loss. So realizing that that's the disease, that's not her, she can't help it, you know, so, so, but, but a lot of people, I go to these support groups, and I hear these stories that the conflict that that develops over that so it takes a lot of grace and and endurance to navigate that course, it progressed to the point where she needed to be in a memory care facility. But during that time, I got connected with a lot of different people dealing with the same thing and finding that most people are not prepared to deal with it or understand it when they get the diagnosis. So I think more people can understand ahead of time and to know that as the baby boom generation gets on up in the years, there's going to be more than I mean this, the studies and research shows that that's the case. So I think every need, every big need, is a big opportunity. So I do we, I think we have lots of opportunities in that area, but also just helping people, younger people, if they have understanding of lifestyle changes that they can take on earlier, earlier, it's going to minimize the possibility of memory loss and the disease.

Dr Hal Habecker: 19:51

So what you're saying is that this neuro plasticity of the brain will really help us maybe stave off. Health, dementia, in some ways, I mean, keeps us healthier, preparing for the future, anticipating the future, and you want to stay as brain healthy, which I would say is spiritually healthy as much as you possibly can. Yeah, and

Unknown: 20:15

that's that's what the research shows us, and that's what the experts would be saying. And most of the people dealing with these issues are approaching it from a a scientific or medical perspective, very little dealing with spiritual and even less dealing with biblical spiritual issues. So our focus is on people's spiritual life and their eternal destiny, because all the rest of it's temporary anyway. I mean, it's important. Treatment and resources are important. But the main focus in what, what I'm involved in, is getting people into a relationship with the Lord. If they already are in a relationship, how do they grow? How do they become fruitful and productive and make an impact? So but one of the things I think we mentioned last time was Psalm 92 which talks about this palm tree, the righteous will be like a palm tree. Yes. And my, my research on palm trees, and what I heard Pat zonderman talked about years ago, and it says that they they will bear fruit in old age. And he points out how the palm trees fruit is sweetest, the older the trees, wow, and the more storms they gain, and it strengthens the root system. So the many parallels there. I thought about starting this, the palm tree initiative.

Dr Hal Habecker: 21:37

I like it. I'm making notes here to myself, so I'm getting lost. So, you know, I think of what warrant is. I think of Psalm 90. It's one of my favorite Psalms by Moses, who had to be maybe a centenarian when he wrote this. But verse 12 teach me to number my days so that I could present to you a heart of wisdom. So this teach me is really helped me to learn and learn and learn and lay that down new neuropaths. You know, you might say about what I'm learning all the time, and that's really what health is all about. I mean, you're growing up processing all of life, yeah,

Unknown: 22:23

yeah. Another aspect I learned about just a few years ago was something calm, the theory of dissipative structures, and the application the theory of dissipative structures, okay? And the expert in that area, he's talked about how that relates to the brain and mental ability and some exercises that we can do, and it's kind of like force feeding your brain until it expands the capacity. And there's some some methods on accelerated learning and reading practices that can do that, and it just it creates more neurons in your brain when you do these exercises.

Dr Hal Habecker: 23:08

Can you give an example?

Unknown: 23:11

Well, one of them that he promotes is speed reading, accelerated learning. And with his method, you can read through the Bible in about six hours. Yeah, wow, you don't retain everything, but there's a method where you go through and then you think about what you can remember. And the idea, and the term I would use is that it force feeds the brain until it expands. And so these are simple techniques of, I guess mental gymnastics that are beneficial. Now, I don't practice that much, but I've done that a few times and so, but when you when you do this speed reading, accelerated learning methods, you retain more than you think you do and and so that's just one, one exercise,

Dr Hal Habecker: 24:01

fast food to faci so let's go back. I mean, one of the general things about aging is that people don't like to change. You know, I always like to use what was the movie made back in the early 90s, Grumpy Old Men. And then they made a sequel, grumpy or old men. Why is that a characteristic of aging? And speak to the value of brain health and regenerating the neurons of the brain, etc, to keep that process, you know, down, I mean, to eliminate it spiritually.

Unknown: 24:38

Well, I think there's a tendency to want to stay in our comfort zones. There's a tendency to always do what we've always done, and there is resistance to change. So I think we have to overcome that by recognizing that everything's changing. We need to change. We need to do things differently. We need to. Learn new things. So as we are committed to that, and then we're intentional about learning new things, going new places, interacting with people, that can be beneficial, the worst thing you can do is sit home and watch TV. And there is this isolation epidemic in the world today, and sociologist refers refer to a friendship recession. Most people don't have very many friends, and most people don't have friends that they can really have substantive conversations with for long periods of time, because everybody's so busy. But so those are things that you know. And I tell people I have a loneliness and isolation prevention program. I just intentionally, I'm proactive in that area more than than most. So intentionally going out, spending time with people and engaging in conversations. Of course, there's always witness and ministry opportunities that come. Yes, yeah,

Dr Hal Habecker: 26:05

we touched on it briefly, but I'd like to dwell on it a little bit. Let's go back to what can the church do now, one of the illustrations you just gave was you could have these memory groups that would really, I mean, they could do in dementia and the development of Alzheimer's. I mean, they you could have a group for caregivers, you know, in that area, and helping the body of Christ to develop more caregivers in that area. Care be care awareness. But you could also have, like, what was the the idea your palm tree groups a beat or, yeah, you can have little cell groups all over your church. But, yeah, I mean, how would, what would should the church do? How would we change the way we do church for aging people?

Unknown: 26:57

Well, we experimented a little bit with this last year. We created the church that I was involved with at the time, we created a memory support group. So we just cast the vision and let people, if they were interested in this, and we would meet every other week. So the memory support group was just to introduce people to resources addressing these issues that we might be amazed at how many people are dealing with memory loss or dementia or Alzheimer's or are just interested in preventing minimizing the possibility. Churches can have training workshops. They can have coaching and mentoring, you know volunteers who get involved, but I think having an ongoing LIKE SHARE organizations, for example, and different different cancer care, but having a member care, various kinds of groups that could be within local churches, but also just educating people public awareness of this, resources that are available. Last year, we started a memory support group at the church I was a part of, and just told people about it, and the people that were interested could come and learn about memory care, memory loss, memory support and helping people, similar to what a lot of churches do with grief share or with cancer, cancer care support groups.

Dr Hal Habecker: 28:32

So one of the things is, I visit churches and we talk about finishing well. And this idea, you know, there are a lot of churches that are busy. They keep us busy in fellowships and dinners and trips and doing things like that. A lot of senior living facilities, they they really keep people busy. But I don't know that busyness is good brain health.

Unknown: 29:02

Well, business is better than a non business. I mean, activity is important, so activities are important, but the right kind of activities, of course, is going to be better. But I think if you go to memory care facilities, I mean, they're professionals, and they have, you know, experts that come in and how they design their programs. So playing games, for examples, strategy grant games, music and entertainment, and, of course, the right kind of music, the right kind of entertainment and various art programs that get people involved in activities. So the activities are important.

Dr Hal Habecker: 29:49

Well, they really would be, because they're they're relationally driven, in a sense. But I think we could add more purpose, sometimes, to our. Context and our relationships, where we're really we're just not doing the same thing, but we're really drilling down on helping us grow and changing our brain, how our brain functions. I think, yeah,

Unknown: 30:13

yeah. I think just the whole aspect of neuroplasticity, understanding how the brain is constantly changing, and getting people to to learn new things and get them giving a few basic things can make a big difference

Dr Hal Habecker: 30:28

in kind of pulling this all together. Talk a little bit about how the brain actually functions. The physiology of the brain, how does, how does growing or how does good brain health work in the physiology of the brain?

Unknown: 30:47

You know, I am not a neurologist or a neuroscientist, so that that's a deeper question than I can I don't know if anybody really understands how the brain works. I mean, there's a lot of studies going on, lot of research going on, but even the even the most advanced research specialists, like the brain center for brain health in Dallas, they have a lot of people in that in that arena, and I hear them from time to time. They have webinars and presentations. So a lot of research going on, but no one really has the finance on how the brain works, other than God. I mean, he created us. We do know that we the brain is important, and if we don't have a healthy brain, we're not going to have a healthy life.

Dr Hal Habecker: 31:36

You know, another challenge that I could come to mind as I think about it is stroke victims, people who have various strokes, and your brain stops working, and then you have all kinds of therapy to regenerate brain growth. You might say,

Unknown: 31:54

yeah. Well, the thing about damage brain, a damaged brain and therapy and recovery from that, some of the principles for therapy can be healthy, just for anyone to have for for example, there are trauma coaches, and there's all kinds of trauma going on in the World. And I have a friend who's a trauma recovery coach, and so there's different kind of trauma training that's going on. I've connected with the people that are doing, for example, trauma recovery, with former child soldiers in Sudan and Uganda and places post conflict regions, the kind of things that they do with him. A lot of it has to do with narrative therapy that comes out of Australia. And, of course, the whole aspect of neurotology, narrative art forms, oral art forms. So those are they're all good for brain health.

Dr Hal Habecker: 33:03

It's a fascinating subject, isn't it? God wants us to stay healthy, not only physically. I mean, the aging is the deterioration of the body and the brain and might say, but he's given us resources to use them and to stay as healthy as we possibly can. Yeah,

Unknown: 33:23

well, and speaking of resources, I know that's going to be a topic you want to talk about. So at any given time, I can give you work where I have found the best resources. And one of them I've already mentioned I mentioned last time was the brain and memory health, org, excuse me, it.com's brother, I found out it's brain and memory, health.com and doctor, yeah, it's comp Dr. Linda faster, so she's the one I learned about the sense, brain sense, and the socialization, education and exercise, all that we talked about before. So that's one. There's another one amazing place. And it's amazing place.org It's here in Houston, and they have an A brain health education component, and they have resources on their website. I mean, there's so much that you can pick up on online these days. In Fort Wayne, Indiana, there's the mind cap Center, Dr Jeannie Zehr, she's become a friend. In fact, she's become a partner with the James Houston center for faith and successful agent that got connected with Michael Parker. So it's Bray, excuse me, it's mind hyphen cap.org, and cap stands for cognitive Advantage programs, okay? And of course, I've already mentioned Center for Brain Health in Dallas, it's Center for Brain health.org they have lots of resources there, so those are the ones that I've learned most from and find. Most beneficial and and some of them are more faith based. I mean, they're run by mostly believers, but it's, it's dealing with the most helpful, fruitful practices that are out there, both from a scientific and medical issue, but also favorable to faith based approach. One

Dr Hal Habecker: 35:23

final thought. I mean, just listening to your expertise and your experience in this, I'm going to say this humorously, but I think there's a lot of truth in it. Maybe every church ought to have a brain health expert.

Unknown: 35:36

I think they should. I think they should, you

Dr Hal Habecker: 35:39

know, overlooking our what we're doing in church, the disciplines we have, the groups we have, and how are we the most healthy we can be, spiritually and personally, in this process of doing life, following Jesus?

Unknown: 35:57

Yeah, I just had a conversation recently, someone said they have this brain trust. I think if we use that term is used sometimes, but just looking at the collective knowledge and wisdom around these issues, getting a few people together to have conversations and thinking about how we can then increase awareness and use these use this learning for Kingdom purposes, and there's plenty of opportunities in that area and addressing the area of loneliness with with, you know, divorces and widowed you know widows and widowers and people tend to be more isolated for Looking for ways to connect with him, create community and and support. I think those are important areas. It's

Dr Hal Habecker: 36:46

all about the church, isn't it?

Unknown: 36:49

That's what the church is supposed to do. I think.

Dr Hal Habecker: 36:52

And Jerry talking to you energizes me. It really, really helps me think a lot about myself, the work we're doing, the work you're doing, and I'm going to pray that God will prosper you in every way. And thank you. Thank you. Thank you for helping us think today,

Unknown: 37:11

well, I think this is cutting edge stuff, and of course, overlapping what we're talking about with what I've been doing with the morality training and spending time in Africa and Asia, Latin America, and learning from those and a friend of mine talks about memory cultures, because the way people think in those places. And we've done these trainings in places where people might speak 10 or 12 languages. They may not read or write any of them, but they're amazingly bright people. They just have a different way of learning, a different world view. So learning about those cultures and learning from the people we train it that's an amazing thing. Uh,

Dr Hal Habecker: 37:57

let me ask you one last thought here. Uh, just you personally, in addition to what you're doing here with me. I mean, but what are some of the other things you're doing in your life that relate relate to brain health ministry, like, how can we as we think about you being down there? How can we think and pray about for you as you extend the impact of what God's doing in your life to other people?

Unknown: 38:23

Well, I have an informal mentoring network the people that I'm discipling and and pouring into them. So the mentoring network and I have some ministry partnerships. I serve as a mission advisor with missile Nexus that's connected with the Lausanne Movement, world Evangelical Alliance, in addition to my living water international work, and so I've been involved in city strategies and mobilizing, Mission mobilization efforts. So I'm a variety of things going and one of the things I failed to mention, as far as mental stimulation is just driving in Houston traffic. Of course, Dallas traffic might be helpful too, but these are, I mean, simple things that you know we don't think about, but activity, mental alertness and prayer and meditation. But I'm, I'm doing more writing and radio program production, and then I'm getting into a few other related aspects. So I'm with my new book, simple relational disciple making ancient ways from modern times. So with my new book, it's just been released, I'm doing more activity with that. I did a zoom call podcast interview this morning, and then I have some more of those kind of things coming up. I don't have a book tour, so that's been good for me. I. To do that was out in Nevada and produced a training course that complements the content of the book, and then produce a study guide. So these are all activities I'm involved in personally. And I'm thinking every morning, I'm thinking about what's the most important things I can do today, what's the most high impact activities I can engage in, and asking the Lord to give me direction. You know, I'm I know that he has a strategic plan, if I'm just listening to him, identifying his activity and joining him. My friend and mentor, Henry Blackley, talked about that, but mentors and models in ministry that's been a part of my journey, and continuing on and just looking for how I can pour into other people's lives, what the Lord supported in my life now. So this, there's a couple of chapters in my book that address those issues.

Dr Hal Habecker: 40:54

Well, that's another topic I want to address in a future podcast, and I don't want to wait too long to do it, so I'll be in touch with you, Jerry, and I cannot thank you enough on behalf of what God's doing in your life and how you have energized me since we've met a couple years ago. And you know, just sharing this, the impact of the Holy Spirit's work in our lives with others, and that's what we're really about finishing, well, ministries and our own personal lives.

Unknown: 41:21

Well, keep me, keep me posted. Let me know what we can do together. And we know that with Christ in our lives, the best is yet to be. And so we're always looking forward to, you know what God has next?

Dr Hal Habecker: 41:34

That's great. Well, thanks, Jerry. And I will invite all of our listeners to remember, pray for Jerry and and thanks for your input. Help us to be the kind of people, oh God, that are alive and learning and eager to be about your task in our life. So the Lord, bless you, Jerry and pray for finishing well ministries and the work God's doing here. And we'll be careful to give God the praise for all he does. So thanks, Jerry again, and have a blessed day. Thank you for listening to this. Finish it well podcast. We hope you were encouraged by today's conversation and living out your God given purpose. Subscribe to the show wherever you get your podcast, or you can find us at finishing well. Ministries.org forward slash podcast. If you have a question, a comment or a suggestion or an idea, send a note to me how finishing well. Ministries.org check out our website and our vision to change the way we think about our aging season of life. Go to finish well ministries.org, and visit our website. We'll see you next time, and may the Lord bless and encourage you.